Why Ron Paul Is Wrong.

[I B Hankering]

The physical presence of U.S. troops in SW Asia and the Middle East is only a small part of why the Muslim world has an anti-U.S. bias. What the Muslim world is really afraid of is the importation of Western culture as typified by U.S. democratic and egalitarian traditions. The current attack on Barbie Dolls in Iran is only another example of pernicious misogyny that prevails in Islamic states and cults that are dead-set on destroying the U.S.’s economy, associated U.S.’s traditions and its international position.

Iran: Morality Police Cracking Down On Barbie Dolls

By Mitra Amiri

TEHRAN, Jan 16 (Reuters) - Iran's morality police are cracking down on the sale of Barbie dolls to protect the public from what they see as pernicious western culture eroding Islamic values, shopkeepers said on Monday.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...6pLid%3D128097

[CuteOldGuy]

The reason the Iranians and others in the Middle East hate us is not because of our culture, it's because we've been bombing them and telling them what to for over 60 years. When we topple their governments, install our puppets, steal their land and resources, it's not hard to figure out why they hate us.

Iran doesn't hate our culture, in fact, they want to learn more about it. They have the will for freedom and prosperity, but since we have opposed them since 1953, they are going to oppose us. If we left them alone, they would be quite content. The only reason they care about Israel is that they know that gets under our skin, otherwise, they'd leave them alone, too.

More bombing and killing is not the answer. Our oil companies aren't worth it. That's all this is about, the oil companies and the defense industry. Why did we depose the government of Iran and install the Shah? It's because they were going to nationalize their oil, and make money off it, too, in addition to our oil companies. We couldn't stand that, so we installed the Shah to keep Iranian oil American.

Culture? They don't give a damn. They want to be left alone.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

The reason the Iranians and others in the Middle East hate us is not because of our culture, it's because we've been bombing them and telling them what to for over 60 years. When we topple their governments, install our puppets, steal their land and resources, it's not hard to figure out why they hate us.

Iran doesn't hate our culture, in fact, they want to learn more about it. They have the will for freedom and prosperity, but since we have opposed them since 1953, they are going to oppose us. If we left them alone, they would be quite content. The only reason they care about Israel is that they know that gets under our skin, otherwise, they'd leave them alone, too.

More bombing and killing is not the answer. Our oil companies aren't worth it. That's all this is about, the oil companies and the defense industry. Why did we depose the government of Iran and install the Shah? We did it for Jolly Old England. It's because they were going to nationalize their oil, and make money off it, too, in addition to our oil companies. We couldn't stand that, so we installed the Shah to keep Iranian oil American. We didn't. We did it to keep it British.

Culture? They don't give a damn. They want to be left alone.

Most of the Islamic nations and cults in the world refuse to accept women and followers of: Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc., as equals in society, and they militantly reject any person, nation or idea that might upset their theocratic regimes. Ask Daniel Pearl.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

The physical presence of U.S. troops in SW Asia and the Middle East is only a small part of why the Muslim world has an anti-U.S. bias. What the Muslim world is really afraid of is the importation of Western culture as typified by U.S. democratic and egalitarian traditions. The current attack on Barbie Dolls in Iran is only another example of pernicious misogyny that prevails in Islamic states and cults that are dead-set on destroying the U.S.’s economy, associated U.S.’s traditions and it’s international position.

Iran: Morality Police Cracking Down On Barbie Dolls

By Mitra Amiri

TEHRAN, Jan 16 (Reuters) - Iran's morality police are cracking down on the sale of Barbie dolls to protect the public from what they see as pernicious western culture eroding Islamic values, shopkeepers said on Monday.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...6pLid%3D128097

Sounds allot like our Moral Majority folks back in the '80's.


Some issues for which the Moral Majority campaigned included:[17]

• Censorship of media outlets that promote an "anti-family" agenda
• Enforcement of a traditional vision of family life
• Opposition to the Equal Rights Amendment and Strategic Arms Limitation Talks
• Opposition to state recognition and acceptance of homosexual acts
• Outlawing abortion in all cases, even to save a woman's life
• Targeting Jews and other non-Christians for conversion to conservative Christianity

[JD Barleycorn]

So Japan loved our culture in 1941 and that is why they attacked us... I didn't know that. That must be the reason that Hitler attacked the USSR in 1941, he wanted borsch.

[CuteOldGuy]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Most of the Islamic nations and cults in the world refuse to accept women and followers of: Christianity, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc., as equals in society, and they militantly reject any person, nation or idea that might upset their theocratic regimes. Ask Daniel Pearl.

Daniel Pearl was post-1953, and was, of course, an atrocity. We still have no right to tell other countries what to do.

I'm not excusing Islamic terrorism, I'm explaining it. Someone has to be the grown up for it to stop, and I think it should be us.

[wellendowed1911]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Daniel Pearl was post-1953, and was, of course, an atrocity. We still have no right to tell other countries what to do.

I'm not excusing Islamic terrorism, I'm explaining it. Someone has to be the grown up for it to stop, and I think it should be us.

I agree with COG- the U.S handled the Iran situation totally wrong. The U.S backed the Shah who when he was in power made President Assad look like an angel- the Shah was corrupt, ruthless and killed many innocent people who spoke out against the govt- the U.S knew this but turned the other way because strategically Iran was important because it bordered USSR.
Even after the Shah was toppled the U.S refused to turn over the Shah to the Iranians so he can face trial for his atrocities. So tell me what's the difference between the Shah who corrupted and stole money from hs people, imprisoned and had thousands of Iranians killed than OBL??? The U.S wanted the Taliban to give up OBL to face charges of terrorism for 9-11 correct? So t was ok for the U.S to refuse to give up a criminal (Shah) but horrible and so wrong for the Taliban to not give up OBL? Anyone see something fishy???

[TheDaliLama]

My God Man!

Just WHO ALL are we telling what to do and WHO ALL are we bombing?

Bad guys in Iraq?
Bad guys is Afghanistan?
Bad guys in Pakistan?
Bad guys in Yeman?

They're all BAD GUYS we're bombing!

You have a problem with enemy identification

[CuteOldGuy]

Something fishy? Why, we are the USofA. Do what we tell you or you will be bombed. Give us your oil, land AND respect. I know we gave you money to fight the Soviets, (Taliban are former Mujahadeen) but now you are in OUR way. Goddammit, become Christians and maybe the bombing will stop!

[CuteOldGuy]

Uh, Your Assholiness, none of those "bad guys" presented any threat to us. We decided to bomb them to make sure our oil companies could gouge us with high prices.

911 bombers? They were Saudi. Saudi Arabia provides us oil. No real questions asked, as long as our Presidents bow to them. So guess what? No bombs for Saudi Arabia!

No one in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan or Yemen was our enemy, until we decided that they were. In fact, we provided aid to the regimes in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, until we decided that anyone who wears a towel on their head is our enemy. Except Saudi Arabia. Because they provide us oil.

What a pile of shit. Our enemies are in Washington and on Wall Street. You're the one who feasts on what the media tells you, instead of looking for the real bad guys.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by wellendowed1911

I agree with COG- the U.S handled the Iran situation totally wrong. The U.S backed the Shah who when he was in power made President Assad look like an angel- the Shah was corrupt, ruthless and killed many innocent people who spoke out against the govt- the U.S knew this but turned the other way because strategically Iran was important because it bordered USSR. This is significant. Perhaps you should study it more closely and discover why so. But be forewarned, it might ruin your rosy 20/20 hindsight if you were to ever actually gaze on the truth.
Even after the Shah was toppled the U.S refused to turn over the Shah to the Iranians so he can face trial for his atrocities. So tell me what's the difference between the Shah who corrupted and stole money from hs people, imprisoned and had thousands of Iranians killed than OBL??? The U.S wanted the Taliban to give up OBL to face charges of terrorism for 9-11 correct? So t was ok for the U.S to refuse to give up a criminal (Shah) but horrible and so wrong for the Taliban to not give up OBL? Anyone see something fishy???

When will you realize that the U.S. government is responsible for looking out for the interests of U.S. citizens first and foremost?

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Uh, Your Assholiness, none of those "bad guys" presented any threat to us. We decided to bomb them to make sure our oil companies could gouge us with high prices.

911 bombers? They were Saudi. Saudi Arabia provides us oil. No real questions asked, as long as our Presidents bow to them. So guess what? No bombs for Saudi Arabia!

No one in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan or Yemen was our enemy, until we decided that they were. In fact, we provided aid to the regimes in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan, until we decided that anyone who wears a towel on their head is our enemy. Except Saudi Arabia. Because they provide us oil.

What a pile of shit. Our enemies are in Washington and on Wall Street. You're the one who feasts on what the media tells you, instead of looking for the real bad guys.

Bin Laden was a Saudi too, but he chose to live in Afghanistan and then Pakistan.

[CuteOldGuy]

Yes, the US government is responsible for looking out for American interests first. But they don't. They look out for the interests of the Oil and Defense industries. We could have worked with the democratically elected government of Iran to support us against the Russians, but they were going want some oil profits for themselves. So fuck the democratically elected government, and let's install a ruthless dictator who will let our oil companies suck the country dry.

Sorry, IB. Money and lobbyists count more than citizens.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Yes, the US government is responsible for looking out for American interests first. But they don't. They look out for the interests of the Oil and Defense industries. We could have worked with the democratically elected government of Iran to support us against the Russians, but they were going want some oil profits for themselves. So fuck the democratically elected government, and let's install a ruthless dictator who will let our oil companies suck the country dry.

No one can say with certainty what might have happened if there had been no coup in '53. But what you and WE are overlooking is the nature of the "big picture" in 1953: the Cold War.

Yes, the British wanted their refinery and other property back - the ones Mossadeq had nationalized (President Harry S. Truman’s Secretary of State Dean Acheson wrote, “Never had so few lost so much so stupidly”). But the U.S. was actually more concerned with the growing strength of Iran's Tudeh party and the possibility that Iran might slide into the Soviet sphere - the Soviets were right next door. For the U.S. it was a two-for-one deal. Eliminate the Tudeh party and repatriate British investments to its ally: Great Britain; thus, secure Iran for the West.

You and WE can deprecate and scoff all you want, but you're imposing your post 1989 notions on a situation that was not so clear in 1953. That's called 20/20 hindsight. Furthermore, you cannot say with certainty that Iran would not have slipped in to the Soviet sphere, nor can you define what such a geopolitical shift might have had on subsequent history.

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Sorry, IB. Money and lobbyists count more than citizens.

I wouldn't vote if I truly believed that.

[CuteOldGuy]

If it makes you feel better to think that politicians actually care about you, go ahead. You're wrong, but go ahead. I still think there was a better way to handle Iran in 1953 than to install a brutal dictator. And what gives us the right to thwart a freely elected government even if they do decide to enter the Soviet sphere? We let other countries fall to the Soviets, but alas, they had no oil, so no help from the US. Is it that hard to see that our foreign and defense policies have been corrupted by the Military Industrial Complex, as Eisenhower warned us? We've wasted too many lives lining the pockets of corporations and America is less secure now than anytime since the Cuban Missile Crisis. And we have lost plenty of freedom as well. But the banks and the corporations don't mind if America becomes a police state. They still own the government.

I still vote, but not for anyone I know will perpetuate the fraud that is being forced upon us. That means I won't be voting for Obama or Romney. I couldn't face myself in the morning or sleep at night if I supported either one of them. But I always vote.