A Hedonist’s Hero

[I B Hankering]

"‘Where is a hedonist to look for heroes?’ Needless to say, not in your neighborhood house of worship. One might consider Charlie Sheen, without the misogynic aggression of course, but there is another. A Greek philosopher whose name has become synonymous with the life of pleasure—especially sensual pleasures, and above all those of a gourmet: Epicurus. Now Epicurus, a 3rd century BCE Athenian, is not commonly ranked in the first tier of philosophers; indeed, for much of the Christian era, he has been condemned as a pig and a sex-maniac (an original hobbyist? lol). A 12th-century bishop once wrote that ‘the world is filled with Epicureans for the simple reason that in its great multitude of men there are few who are not slaves to lust.’ Attacks on Epicurus were also common during his lifetime. One disgruntled ex-follower said that Epicurus vomited twice a day from over-eating, and engaged in ‘notorious midnight philosophizings’ in his garden with four women called Hedeia (‘Sweety-Pie’), Erotion (‘Lovie’), Nikidion (‘Little Victory’) and Mammarion (‘Big Tits’)." This would assuredly qualify him as a hedonist's hero!

And as Musman so often reminds us:

“The art of life lies in taking pleasures as they pass, and the keenest pleasures are not intellectual, nor are they always moral.” ~ Aristippus


Came across this amusing train of thought while I was Googling 'Aristippus', and thought I'd share.

IBH

[causewaycommuter]

IBH, thanks for the info. It's really good to see some fellow higher thinking members of the board. I'm a big fan of Epicurus. So much so that I named my handle here after him.

[Musman]

Thanks for the nod on my signiture quote, IBH. As you probably came across in your research, it looks like Aristippus may have been the original hedonist. He came along before Epicurus and inspired him.

The following paragraph is quoted from the Internet Encyclopedia of Philosophy

"Aristippus (c.435-356 BCE)

Aristippus was a follower of Socrates, and the founder of the Cyrenaic school of philosophy. Like other Greek ethical thinkers, Aristippus’ ethics are centered around the question of what the ‘end’ is; that is, what goal our actions aim at and what is valuable for its own sake. Aristippus identified the end as pleasure. This identification of pleasure as the end makes Aristippus a hedonist. Most of the pleasures that Aristippus is depicted as pursuing have to do with sensual gratification, such as sleeping with courtesans and enjoying fine food and old wines. He taught that we should not defer pleasures that are ready at hand for the sake of future pleasures. He was willing to break the social conventions of his day and engage in behavior that was considered undignified or shocking for the sake of obtaining pleasurable experiences. His ideal life would be branded by most Greeks as being enslaved to pleasure.The Cyrenaic school developed these ideas further and influenced Epicurus and the later Greek skeptics."

Sound familiar, folks? How much do hobbiests and providers have in common with his philosophy?

MM

[MuffDVR]

The question would be which of the many definitions of hedonist describes you. simply the pursuit of pleasure, or is it a life spent mostly for that pursuit.

[MuffDVR]

Problem with being a hedonist, it encompasses in that group that we may not wish to be included in, we all find different things in sex to be stimulating. while others may find pain to be pleasure, wwe may not, and it goes even further, as we must accept rapists and other degenerates are in fact hedonists. One such comes to mind..

" They accuse Caligula of incest with his sisters, Agrippina the Younger, Drusilla and Livilla, and say he prostituted them to other men.[103] They state he sent troops on illogical military exercises,[74][104] turned the palace into a brothel,"

[MuffDVR]

... and to me My Hedonist Hero... the one and only..

"All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dream with open eyes, to make it possible. This I did"

Peter O'toole

[Musman]

Originally Posted by causewaycommuter

IBH, thanks for the info. It's really good to see some fellow higher thinking members of the board. I'm a big fan of Epicurus. So much so that I named my handle here after him.

Ok, CC. I'll bite. How did you derive "causewaycommuter" from "Epicurus"?

MM

[ElisabethWhispers]

Originally Posted by Musman

Ok, CC. I'll bite. How did you derive "causewaycommuter" from "Epicurus"?

MM

I'm standing next to Musman with his question as well.

Curious kisses,
Elisabeth

[causewaycommuter]

It's a loose translation

[I B Hankering]

“All men dream: but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds wake in the day to find that it was vanity: but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act their dream with open eyes, to make it possible. This I did.” ~ Peter O'Toole

The O'Toole quote reminded me of one by Edgar Allan Poe that I came across recently: “Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things which escape those who dream only by night.” Yet I accept that O'Toole’s is the more powerful of the two.

It’s curious that you should have mentioned Caligula. I had quite forgotten that Peter O'Toole played Tiberius in Bob Guccione’s 1979 film on that subject; wherein, Guccione chose to graphically illustrate Lord Acton’s maxim: “Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts, absolutely.” A premise subsequently supported by some U.S. courts that ruled that the film was not just pornography, but an art film with a message. In the movie, and in fact, Caligula was insane. Some say his living in perpetual fear of his tyrannical great-uncle Tiberius caused Caligula to go insane. Whatever the reason, his insanity is not debated; thus, it might be argued, Caligula could not at the same time be a hedonist. A hedonist, though basically somewhat selfish, understands that he or she is seeking pleasure, whereas, by definition, an insane person understands nothing and act as no rational person would.

Yes, there are degenerates such as rapists, but these are more properly called criminals: not hedonists. If you call a rapist a hedonist, could you not also argue that ascetics, such as St Simeon Stylites the Elder, 388-459 CE, who sat atop a pole for thirty years, are hedonists. Was this not what gave them their greatest pleasure? If so, then what is the value of being ascetics if you also call them hedonists? Epicuris believed in taking pleasures as the opportunities presented themselves and believed everyone would lead a happier life if they did likewise. He did not believe in asceticism, but neither did his idea of happiness ever include being cruel to others. That also was contrary to his beliefs.

As I conclude, I cannot help but recall that there are different kinds of cruelty. I am reminded of an old joke about a sadist and a masochist. The masochist cries, “Hit me! Hit me!” The sadist, with a grin, replies, “No-oo.”

[pornodave69]

Originally Posted by Musman

Ok, CC. I'll bite. How did you derive "causewaycommuter" from "Epicurus"?

MM

Originally Posted by ElisabethWhispers

I'm standing next to Musman with his question as well.

Curious kisses,
Elisabeth

Originally Posted by causewaycommuter

It's a loose translation

Apparently, VERY loose.

[MuffDVR]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

Yes, there are degenerates such as rapists, but these are more properly called criminals: not hedonists. If you call a rapist a hedonist, could you not also argue that ascetics, such as St Simeon Stylites the Elder, 388-459 CE, who sat atop a pole for thirty years, are hedonists. Was this not what gave them their greatest pleasure?

while i can understand the value of what you are saying in direction, im not certain you have reached a level plane. Doesnt one definition of a hedonist,(a devotion to pleasure as a way of life) as well as society today state that it is in fact insanity itself, is it not called by another name? "Sexual Addiction". I would have to argue that although a rapist is performing a criminal act, he would be a true hedonist in that in fact he absolutely places his deranged sex life as the most important part of his existance, even as far as to risk life and freedom in its pursuit. Now certainly i would not argue any correctness in such actions, however in the direction of hedonism, would this not be the amalgamation of hedonism and its definitions?

[CRISTY-CUPPS]

http://www.hedonism.com/

How about the resort??

BTW..CC...
your avatar, uhhh scary.
lol

[causewaycommuter]

Cristy, you like my avatar? I was a big fan or wrestling as a kid, back in the days of ridiculously over the tops story lines and characters. My avatar is Kamala the Ugandan Giant (supposedly he killed a lion with his bare hands, but I haven't been able to substantiate that...). I figured with the high brow discussion of ancient philosophers/poon hounds, what better way to make sure us common folk (myself definitely included) participate in such an educatinally enlightened thread.

[pornodave69]

Originally Posted by causewaycommuter

Cristy, you like my avatar? I was a big fan or wrestling as a kid, back in the days of ridiculously over the tops story lines and characters. My avatar is Kamala the Ugandan Giant (supposedly he killed a lion with his bare hands, but I haven't been able to substantiate that...). I figured with the high brow discussion of ancient philosophers/poon hounds, what better way to make sure us common folk (myself definitely included) participate in such an educatinally enlightened thread.

What, no Andre the Giant? No Captain Lou Albano? Ah, the glory days of fake TV wrasslin'.