no vaccine - no access ?

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by Levianon17

The bottom line is there is no legal obligation for a person to disclose his or her medical information to a Business Establishment for service. Now a person may be denied service and ask to leave and there could be some pretty nasty legal issues behind it. I am not sure how the courts would handle such as case, but I think the future will bring about Vaccine Identification and Business Establishments would be in their legal right to confirm if a patron is vaccinated and deny service if they aren't.

And that will be an economic disaster in my opinion and AGAIN, at some point, the SC will have to way in on this because the legal cases are just beginning.

[HedonistForever]

[QUOTE=txdot-guy;1062492401]Would your argument be different if someone came to the door of your business coughing, sneezing, wiping their nose with their sleeve and looking like they might vomit? Could you deny them service if they are showing signs of a contagious illness?


Yes! Completely different than asking every single individual to prove they aren't sick and if vaccinated people can test positive for Covid, what good does asking for proof do you?


How do you know if someone is infected with a contagious illness. As the owner of a private business can you mandate a temperature check before coming in and then deny service based on the result?


In an emergency, apparently you can. How about when the emergency is over which by the look of all the crowds, it is, for now.


Is there a line where it's appropriate to allow private businesses the ability to deny service for health reasons and if so why is the covid-19 vaccination any different?[/QUOTE]


OK, so from now on, every business can stop you and ask you for proof you don't have seasonal flu, TB, herpes etc, etc.? At what other time were people asked to prove their health before they could enter a store? And if we do reach herd immunity, which it looks like we have considering we will never again be free from Covid for all 320 million of us, can we ever return to normal where we assume that most of us will not get sick and those that choose not to get vaccinate may by their choice.


I don't see any way in hell, we will survive in a "show me your papers" world when millions will refuse to take this vaccine. Can we really say "you are not welcome" as we did with race in our past? How did that work out?


Consider that a whole lot of Black people will not be taking this vaccine. Can you imagine the shit show that will bring if Blacks are denied service, AGAIN?


Here in Florida, all those stores that had signs that say, "you may not enter without facial covering", now say "facial covering is not required for those who have been vaccinated but still required if you have not" but it is an honor system because you may not be asked to "see your papers".

[darthvader6969]

Bunch of fucking sensitive idiots complaining about the COVID vaccine cause all they do is watch conspiracy videos on YouTube at 2 AM. Stop COVID and get vaccinated. Simple as that. No vaccine, no service. No vaccine, no travel.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by darthvader6969

Bunch of fucking sensitive idiots complaining about the COVID vaccine cause all they do is watch conspiracy videos on YouTube at 2 AM. Stop COVID and get vaccinated. Simple as that. No vaccine, no service. No vaccine, no travel.

yeah. let's all take an experimental vaccine with growing data showing potential side effects for a "death plague" with a less than 1 percent fatality rate. yeah. let's all do that. Not.

[Strokey_McDingDong]

CDC Director says masks offer more protection than the vaccine.

[dilbert firestorm]

Originally Posted by Strokey_McDingDong

I'm in the KKK.

Originally Posted by Strokey_McDingDong

I'm gay.

Originally Posted by Tiny

I'm calling bull shit on this. You're not gay or a member of the KKK. If you are prove it. Post some of your photos of secret gay Klan rituals. Please black out the penises.

to be in KKK and gay, you'd have to be democrat.

[Ripmany]

I need to get a second set from a nother drug store just in case I get rob and lose my card.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

That's why I said the Supreme Court needs to way in on this right now, it's to important an issue to let linger. Here in Florida it has already been decided that we will not have two classes of citizens and have to "show your papers" to get the rights we all have to go about our lives freely. Our Gov. ( for now, I hope he sticks to his guns ) is willing to give up the entire Cruise Industry, a very big economic deal her in South Florida, in order to not give them the ability to take away the right of an un-vaccinated person to do all the things vaccinated people can do like go on a cruise. I support that decision.

#NO PAPERS NEEDED IN FLORIDA

I've been vaccinated, what business is it of mine if others haven't? I can't get Covid and I can't give Covid, the CDC told me so.

I have not read all the responses in this thread.

No the CDC has not said you can't get COVID if you've been vaccinated. The odds are between 80-95% that you won't get COVID based on the manufacturer.

I have a cruise planned in December. However, if I was going on one of the cruises planned in July or August I fully support the rule that would not allow unvaccinated guests on the cruise. If just one of the thousands of people on board comes down with the virus, the cruise is basically ruined for all. I realize that even limiting passengers to fully vaccinated people, someone can come down with COVID, which recently happened. But the goal should be to reduce the odds as much as possible. But DeSantis has made his decision.

[Jacuzzme]

Yeah, give the non-vaxed heretics a gold star and let them take the train.

[1blackman1]

I’ll say it again. Private business can preclude you from their establishment as long as it’s not for a legislatively excluded reason (race age sex gender religion). No they cannot make you show them your vax status but if you choose not to disclose it you can’t come into their business. You control that choice.

As hard as it is to believe p, in 2021, discrimination per se is not unlawful. The law only specifically delineates a few unlawful discriminations as listed above. To date, vax status isn’t one of them. I’m not familiar with TX or FL laws that were recently passed but if they delineate vax status then it was be a unlawful discrimination.

Nevertheless, simply assuming that (without a specific law) people are allowed to enter whatever business they want because this is the land of the free is incorrect and unsupported in the law.

[Levianon17]

Originally Posted by Strokey_McDingDong

I got denied service once because of my allergies. It was at a bar, and I looked absolutely trashed, even though I didn't even start drinking yet. I remember when I was a kid, everyone thought I was a stoner when I was like 13, because of my allergies. I was known as a pot head before I ever smoked any pot. "Bro, how stoned are you right now?" I've never even smoked weed before wtf?

The main feature of this thread is not if someone is showing obvious signs of being sick but to show proof of being vaccinated. Showing documentation of something that isn't public record. Personally if I was the business owner or manager I wouldn't have kicked you out, I would have put you in the Bathroom, lol. Why lose business over some guy sneezing.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Just last week in Houston:

Federal judge dismisses lawsuit from Texas hospital employees over COVID vaccine requirement

U.S. district judge Lynn N. Hughes said in his ruling that claims that the vaccines are dangerous are "false, and it is also irrelevant." Hughes noted that Texas law "only protects employees from being terminated for refusing to commit an act carrying criminal penalties to the worker," and that receiving a COVID-19 vaccine "is not an illegal act."

[Yssup Rider]

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

Yeah, give the non-vaxed heretics a gold star and let them take the train.

Just WOW!

Could you find a more offensive and inappropriate comparison?

Asking for 6,000,000 friends.

[VitaMan]

Hospitals, especially hospital employees, is just one of the many different situations that will come up. I wonder what unions would have to say about this issue.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

See, you are now trying to make a point different than what is intended. Florida isn't trying to tell any company what they "can do", "you must do this", they are telling them what they can not do ( discriminate ) because it would violate the basic freedom of choice held by the individual not the conglomerate. Any way you look it, you come back to one very basic concept and that is "show me your papers". Do we do that for TB, a highly contagious disease? Will you now have to also prove you don't have TB if you have to prove you don't have Covid? What if we now have to submit to a temperature check every flu season since many, many people die from the flu every year?

I can see your point of view as applied to, say, blacks and Republicans. Although not to registered Democrats. Just kidding Democrats.

Businesses should have the right to serve who they want to serve. If they don't want to sell to you because you don't have a COVID vaccination or a TB test or because you refuse to submit to a temperature test, then that's their right in a free society.

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

The very first cruise with everybody on board being vaccinated, ended up with two passengers testing positive on board. The cruise went on, everybody kept eating dinner together and going to shows, the ship did not become a death cruise. So if in the foreseeable future, the cruise industry will have to survive on the people who love cruising so much that after being vaccinated, they will still cruise and those like my friend who is vaccinated, says he will never cruise again unless the ship is allowed to bar anybody not vaccinated. OK, scratch him, fuck him. If you can cruise without asking for papers fine. If you can't, you can't. Life will go on and I honestly believe cruising will go on and from Florida. We'll see but I still support Gov. DeSantis's stand.

43.4% of Americans have been fully vaccinated. Count in people who've received one shot and those who had the disease but not the vaccine, and maybe around 60% are reasonably well protected.

What about the other 40%? These cruise ships have been shown to be COVID incubators. You've got a lot of people crammed into a small place, and the people who haven't gotten vaccinated probably aren't going to wear N95 masks either. You get something like the Delta variant on a cruise ship and not only are you going to have the unvaccinated coming down with COVID, but vaccinated people as well. A recent study out of Scotland indicates the Pfizer vaccine, the best of the bunch, is only 79% effective against that variant, which has rapidly come to account for the majority of cases in the UK and India. There's a good chance it will be the dominant strain in the U.S. soon too. The Delta Variant not only is highly contagious, but once infected it's about 2X as likely to put a person into the hospital as the UK variant, which currently is number one in the United States.

There are more people like your friend than you think. Do the Cruise Lines want to do this because they're bleeding hearts out to save humanity from the unvaccinated heathen? Hell no. They want to do it to make more money, so that people won't be afraid to go on cruises and so they won't get sued.

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

Because nobody was vaccinated. They will be now and the few that are not vaccinated will not adversely effect those that are. That is what the data shows, does it not? No, not 100% but there is no such thing as 100%, 95% is the new 100% because even if you have been vaccinated and test positive, the data says that you will not get sick.

It's not 95% effective. Again, perhaps 79% for the Delta variant which is crowding out the other ones where it's present. 90% for the UK variant that's currently #1 in the USA. That's with Pfizer. It's less for the other vaccines.

And again, if say 40% of the passengers are not vaccinated, you're telling the Cruise Lines they've potentially got to be prepared to handle localized epidemics onboard if they want to stay in business. Or find someplace other than Florida to set to sea.