Israel Bombs Iranian Nuclear Sites!

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

You can't make it more clear to the MAGAs. From the White House itself.
If anyone is lying and trying to distort the facts, it would be you.

Even one of our staunchest allies can't work with Trump.




“Tonight, Israel took unilateral action against Iran. We are not involved in strikes against Iran and our top priority is protecting American forces in the region,” Secretary of State Marco Rubio said in a statement released by the White House.

that statement doesn't prove your claim. the US was aware of their plan. we are in fact supporting it, supporting Israel defense post attack. did so from the beginning. your fixation on one word ... unilateral .. doesn't confirm your claim "Israel acted because Trump would not". complete nonsense. the US was never going to actively participate in a strike against Iran for many reasons.


you do know Trump gave Iran 60 days to get a deal done, they of course wanted to drag it out thinking Israel wouldn't act. the attack is 61 days, ONE DAY after Trump's deadline.


some intel reports claim Trump and Israel did in fact work together to mislead Iran when Trump was reported to tell Bibi "Not to attack Iran" as a setup.


now how about that?


BAHHAAAAA

[VitaMan]

If you don't want to believe the statement from the Secretary of State, that's on you.

The MAGA cult syndrome has gotten far worse than any TDS.

Now MAGAs don't even believe statements released from the Trump White House.

[lustylad]

If you can't play 4-dimensional Mideast diplomatic chess, that's on you.

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

some intel reports claim Trump and Israel did in fact work together to mislead Iran when Trump was reported to tell Bibi "Not to attack Iran" as a setup.

now how about that?

BAHHAAAAA

Exactly what happened.

VM should read up on the history of WW2. D-Day, also know as Operation Overlord, was preceded by Operation Fortitude.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

If you don't want to believe the statement from the Secretary of State, that's on you.

The MAGA cult syndrome has gotten far worse than any TDS

i believe his statement. i also believe you don't really understand what it meant.


do you really think the US was not completely aware of the impending attack? of course we were and planned for it to support Israel, our ally.

[VitaMan]

Israel acted unilaterally. The Secretary of State agrees with me.

Who agrees with you and your made up ideas ? They almost sound like conspiracy theories

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

Israel acted unilaterally. The Secretary of State agrees with me.

Who agrees with you and your made up ideas ? They almost sound like conspiracy theories

dude stop taking pot shots at me and Jacky.



your claims are nothing more than TDS dismissive nonsense. are you claiming because Israel acted alone that they had to because of Trump? that the US abandoned an ally? forced them to act alone? nonsense.


the US was never going to actively participate in an Israeli led preemptive strike. for reasons apparently beyond your ability to comprehend?


prove that claim isn't a ... TDS conspiracy theory


bahahahaaa

[lustylad]

Still waiting for VM to show us evidence that Trump was prepared to accept a "weak" deal with Iran, and this frightened Bibi into launching military strikes...

[VitaMan]

You need to read the statement released by the White House.

Trump produced many statements before and after the Israeli strike. Best you read up on those and the discussions that resulted, both from the Israeli side and others.

The result is Israel went ahead and acted unilaterally...something you can't seem to admit.

As far as potshots, how many times do we see Jacky and other MAGAs drag out the 3 letters TDS...

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

You need to read the statement released by the White House.

Trump produced many statements before and after the Israeli strike. Best you read up on those and the discussions that resulted, both from the Israeli side and others.

The result is Israel went ahead and acted unilaterally...something you can't seem to admit.

As far as potshots, how many times do we see Jacky and other MAGAs drag out the 3 letters TDS...

then post the statements that prove your point.



we'll wait

[VitaMan]

You have dug yourself a deep hole, bud. Now try and get out of it.

All the Trump statements are easily accessible on the internet. You don't have to wait.

Nothing you posted here has any substance. The fact is Israel acted unilaterally, without the US and Trump. The Secretary of State agrees with me.

Who agrees with you ? We will wait.

Are you going to tie in potshots with TDS ? Jacky mentions TDS in almost every post.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

You have dug yourself a deep hole, bud. Now try and get out of it.

Nothing you posted here has any substance. The fact is Israel acted unilaterally, without the US and Trump.

so what's your claim here? that because the US did not participate Trump is "weak" and we abandoned Israel?


nonsense


this was planned for a long time. the US knew about it all along. in fact Bibi and Trump planned it. they gave Iran a unilateral deadline. then Israel acted.



do you really think the US should have attacked Iran alongside Israel?



that by not doing so shows Trump is weak?


nonsense.


Trump needed to keep the US neutral for many reasons like not giving Iran a direct reason to engage US bases in the region? like after Israel pounds Iran's ass they'll take Trump's negotiations more seriously? like they should have to begin with?


bahahahaaa

[VitaMan]

Make up anything you want. You just dig your hole deeper.

The fact is Israel acted unilaterally.
And to close it as you frequently post when you lose a discussion:

the Secretary of State said so

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

But probably not. Look what the results were when he flew off to North Korea in an attempt to get a Nobel peace prize.

I believe Trump's treatment of Kim Jong Un was inspired. Perhaps in his second term he'll get the Nobel Peace Prize for helping bring North Korea or Russia or Iran back into the mainstream.

North Korea had only one long or medium range ballistic missile test from the date of the announcement of the Singapore meeting until the end of Trump's term. I posted on this in another forum,

http://www.internationalsexguide.nl/...=1#post2943491

Originally Posted by VitaMan

Trump had an entire 4 year term to work with Iran and others in the region. No idea why some keep binging up the Obama administration. Trump served after that. To say the Obama administration is causing this is saying it can never be fixed. Trump had 4 years after Obama to fix it....and he didn't.

To be fair the Biden administration did not fix it either. But at least they are not saying things Trumps normally says, such ax "Israel would never have acted unilaterally under the Biden administration".

Originally Posted by lustylad

Generally, I share your skepticism when it comes to sanctions. But trump's renewal of the "maximum pressure" campaign against Iran in 2018 did help to choke off the flow of funds to the mullahs and thereby inhibit their ability to stir up trouble using their proxies i.e. Hezbollah, Hamas, Houthis, Shia allies in Iraq etc.

Then Biden came in and lifted the sanctions in 2021. The results were a disaster. They show why it's impossible to trust the Iranian mullahs. Instead of saying ok thanks, we'll tone it down, they funneled the billions they received from Biden's sanctions relief right back into the hands of their terrorist proxies.

If you really want to assign proximate blame for the Hamas attack on Oct. 7, 2023 you might consider how much additional funding and other support did Hamas receive from Iran after Biden loosened the screws.

I don't know a lot about Trump's or Biden's sanctions or lack thereof on Iran. And it's not something I'm particularly passionate about.

Given that Trump tried to implement a new agreement with Iran in his second term, you'd figure he screwed up by withdrawing from the first agreement. My impression is that it would be like replacing NAFTA by the USMCA. Because he didn't negotiate it, Trump didn't like it. But the replacement wasn't all that different from what was there in the first place. Again though, I don't know this subject well enough to really argue with you.

Trump's call might have been like choosing to go for it on 4th and 8 when you're on your own 40 yard line in the first quarter. It's a bad call, it doesn't really make sense. But you get a first down and score. And you end up winning the game by 3 points. We're in the 3rd quarter, and at this point it looks like the Trump/Netanyahu good cop/bad cop schtick may result in Iran not developing nuclear weapons. Or in the best of all possible worlds, maybe Khamenei and other hawks get axed. Iran makes peace with its neighbors and develops its economy so that Iranians are much better off materially. Hell if I know. This is above my paygrade.

[biomed1]

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[adav8s28]

Originally Posted by lustylad

I wouldn't put it that way, Waco. I'd say the Obama plan (the so-called JCPOA signed in Oct. 2015) just tried to kick the can down the road, delaying Iran's nuclear program until Obama was safely out of office. You know - let the next guy deal with what happens after the various restrictions run out in 6-10 years. Obama responded to criticism of the deal's sunset provisions by saying we can always do the military strike option later if they refuse to negotiate another 10-year deal in 2025. To me, that was a bad argument for a flawed agreement. Everyone knows the longer Israel refrains from taking out Iran's proliferating nuclear facilities, the harder the task becomes.

You say flawed agreement. Iran had to give up most of the U-235 enriched Uranium that it had after signing the JCPOA in Oct 2015. You remember those Uranium enrichment charts you posted several years back? Iran was just one year away from having enough U-235 to make at least one atomic bomb according to your charts.

The enrichment process was slowed considerably with that agreement. However, that was all lost when Trump cancelled the deal in 2018. Iran could restart the aggressive enrichment process (with no deal in place). Sure enough seven years later they have enough enriched U-235 to make at least one atomic bomb. This was also in the New Yorker article link from post #24. From the link in post #24.

So we’ve talked for a while now, and one thing you haven’t said is that the reason for this attack is that the situation with Iran and nuclear weapons has changed, and that the danger is much greater now. Has it?

This is very important, and I forgot to mention it. On December 5th, six months ago, Iran started doubling down by fuelling its uranium-enrichment facilities so that the product would be one step below the nuclear-weapons threshold. This was reported by the International Atomic Energy Agency. So they edged much closer to the bomb. And, if you look at the timetable—I’m not familiar with the Iranian decision-making process, obviously—but, if you look at the timetable, they did this during the American transition period, which is always a good time to do stuff, when the outgoing Administration is not looking closely and the new one is not in power yet. So they thought that they would enter the negotiations with the United States from a stronger position and maybe show that they are a few weeks away from enriched uranium for nuclear weapons.

Yes, Obama's agreement was only good for a ten year period. Had Trump not cancelled the agreement in 2018 (3 years into a 10 year agreement) Iran would not have been able to achieve the above from the New Yorker link. This is the real reason Bengy N. wanted to strike now, regardless if the USA approved or not. Iran was simply too close to getting an Atomic Bomb. With Trump cancelling Obama's nuke deal with Iran, Iran got to continue with the enrichment process for seven years (2018 - 2025).

I blame Trump for what he did in 2018. Iran would still be 10 years away from an Atomic Bomb if Trump had not cancelled the deal in 2018.
Trump's 60 day Ultimatum would not have been needed. Tiny's link from post #24.

https://www.newyorker.com/news/q-and...trike-iran-now