Indy’s dead for good?

[bambino]

Originally Posted by Double Secret Sam I Am

It will change here no matter what. Time changes everything. I suspect different people will begin to post here because Indys is gone. But that remains to be seen.

Well, you’re here. I’m guessing some of the Stump junkies will show up. There’s a pretty robust political forum on ECCIE. For some reason, there’s not a dedicated sports forum. You can talk sports, but it’s not a big thing here. As for providers, I’m not sure. A few have already. I think they require more documentation to register as a provider here than Indy’s.

[berryberry]

Originally Posted by Double Secret Sam I Am

It will change here no matter what. Time changes everything. I suspect different people will begin to post here because Indys is gone. But that remains to be seen.

Perhaps those guys who swallow their pride after bashing ECCIE over the years may join. Or not. But even if they do, lots of guys have been here a long time and like the ECCIE style so . . .

A number of providers have joined and are placing ads

[Devo]

Originally Posted by Double Secret Sam I Am

Whatever. I’ve had 4 different handles on Indys dating back to 2006. I did enjoy using that site. As stated above however I have used sites other than Indys including escorts.come, date-check, TER, and EROS. I always felt that Indys had its limitations and I looked for other sites to use.

You’re right in saying that I didn’t open an account here until a month ago. Frankly I saw no need to. You can read the forums here without becoming a member. I’m not saying that the reviews here are better, worse or about the same as they were on Indys. I believe you when you say they are “better.” If they primarily relate to women I don’t care to see, however, it hardly matters. I’m not into streetwalkers, AMPs, hood rats or strip joints, but to each his own. I just took a look at the review section a second ago and I will admit that section of this site is surprisingly active all things considered and I did see a few that might be relevant. As stated previously I will probably buy a upgraded membership and find out.

We can agree to disagree. The point of my post was that Indys didn’t fall apart because it was provider centric or because of this site. I think it was successful largely because it was provider centric. In my opinion Indys fell apart largely because of SA and legal problems of its owner. It doesn’t really matter anyway. Indys is gone now. Will this site change as a result? We shall see.

Why did you have four handles???

As for the vouch system, it was designed from the start to abuse the hobbyists, and was soon weaponized by the providers and or owners.

It sucked, glad its gone.

[bambino]

Its a quadruple secret.

[dj8rocks]

Just some thoughts from what I see and read here on YOUR forums.

The Pittsburgh Forums probably have one of the best chances and opportunities to grow their membership, both male and female, than has been presented in quite some time.


With the fiasco of the competing site, that chance is now. But, whether or not they come in masses or in ones and twos will really be influenced by the existing members here.


The atmosphere presented here is one that the members have to really step back and assess. Ask yourself, If I was someone looking for a new site to intermingle with other members, have positive experiences and glean valuable information without having to drudge thru page after page of drama and conflict, would this be the place?


Threads just like this one and several more are what will be the determining factor as to whether or not you grow your membership here.


I personally have nothing to gain or lose if this forum doesn't acquire some of the fledglings that are seeking a new home. Professionally I would love to see your Forum grow and have personally reached out to the new providers that started posting asking them to go thru the process of getting verified.


The question is, do you as the member want to see it grow? These boards are YOURS, Staff just helps maintain the madness to a tolerable degree..

[Double Secret Sam I Am]

Originally Posted by Devo

Why did you have four handles???

As for the vouch system, it was designed from the start to abuse the hobbyists, and was soon weaponized by the providers and or owners.

It sucked, glad its gone.

Lots of members had more than one handle over time. My first handle was the license plate number for my car at the time. I didn’t post anything for more than a year so it wasn’t a big deal but when I started posting regularly I asked for a handle change. I “retired” around the time SBC outed all those guys because I was paranoid it could happen to me. I came back under a new handle and “retired” again around the time of the Cleveland bust for basically the same reason. I came back as Sam I Am roughly a year later. I am Double Secret Sam I Am here because there was already a Sam I am and I like Animal House.

We can agree to disagree about the vouch system. I liked the vouch system Indys used. Never had any issues getting providers to vouch me. At one time I had like 50 or 60 vouches.

And Bambino I can think of three handles you used, so is that a triple secret?

[bambino]

Originally Posted by Double Secret Sam I Am

Lots of members had more than one handle over time. My first handle was the license plate number for my car at the time. I didn’t post anything for more than a year so it wasn’t a big deal but when I started posting regularly I asked for a handle change. I “retired” around the time SBC outed all those guys because I was paranoid it could happen to me. I came back under a new handle and “retired” again around the time of the Cleveland bust for basically the same reason. I came back as Sam I Am roughly a year later. I am Double Secret Sam I Am here because there was already a Sam I am and I like Animal House.

We can agree to disagree about the vouch system. I liked the vouch system Indys used. Never had any issues getting providers to vouch me. At one time I had like 50 or 60 vouches.

And Bambino I can think of three handles you used, so is that a triple secret?

No, mine were never a secret. It was a joke. I liked BigBallsJoey. BBJ for short!!!! now settle down Sam. I was just busting your balls. BTW, it only took BBJ 40 days to go green.

[Double Secret Sam I Am]

I think it took Sam about the same amount of time after about a year off the board to go green. It just wasn’t that hard to get vouches. I actually think it will be much harder for me to see new providers now. I’ve been out of the hobby for roughly a year and most of the girls I know are gone. But we shall see.

[bambino]

Originally Posted by Double Secret Sam I Am

I think it took Sam about the same amount of time after about a year off the board to go green. It just wasn’t that hard to get vouches. I actually think it will be much harder for me to see new providers now. I’ve been out of the hobby for roughly a year and most of the girls I know are gone. But we shall see.

Yeah, about 5 years ago it wasn’t that difficult. Three girls vouched me that had no Idea who I was. But it became pretty tough the last couple years. Josie Wales got to blue in about a month but one of the girls I knew. I had no desire to be a green square. But I really couldn’t because they blocked my PMs. Oh well. There is always more fish in the sea. My money went elsewhere.

[tolstoy]

Originally Posted by berryberry

LOL - This from a guy who not only admits that it has been years since he was a consistent hobby scene guy but who was also dissing ECCIE on TOS when ECCIE went down for a while.

Dude, your knowledge is not current. Ask anyone who has looked at reviews on Indys the last number of years (probably longer) and nearly anyone will tell you they were useless. That is why guys flocked over to ECCIE. So real reviews and info could be shared.

So while you reminisce down memory lane, realize lots of things changed over time

I don't remember "dissing ECCIE on TOS when ECCIE went down for a while", really. Feel free to summarize what my comments were. In fact I ask you to summarize my comments about Eccie on Indys right here in this thread so I know WTF you are talking about....

You and several other guys on this site can continue to BITCH, PISS, WHINE, and MOAN about the Indys review system. All of your BITCHING about Indys reviews has been going on for YEARS now. In fact it is one of the signature hallmarks of this site. Some people agree with you, others don't.....

I was a part of the Indys community for years and part of the ASPD community before that. I can think of about a half-dozen GREATER concerns involving Indys in the years I was a part of it. And guys here are BITCHING about Indys reviews? Much greater concerns with the hobby then and now....

I have not been a consistent Indys or Eccie player for years, but I have been active on SA since long before it started getting any press on Indys or Eccie. Most intel/analysis I have posted in the past few years has related to SA. SA changed the game in PGH. SA is going to continue to get press on this site and the new Indys if the new Indys actually has forums now.....

No, I don't understand all the Eccie guys BITCHING about the Indys review system. I can name several other greater concerns involving Indys that occurred within the last 10 years or so. ECCIE guys WHINING about Indys reviews? Some people agree with it, other people don't agree with it.....

Will Eccie draw more Indys players? Maybe, maybe not. Eccie has had the same dozen or so cast of characters for years. Hopefully more people from Indys make it over here. Get a little more variety here.....

And I hope two (2) sites remain in PGH. Not a good thing if one (1) site is the only game in town. That is what ASPD was in 2004. And because the Texas mods banned people and locked threads too quickly PGH people fled to Indys in 2005. Again, when one (1) site thinks it has a "monopoly" on intel exchange in a market like PGH then that is not good....

[bambino]

Originally Posted by tolstoy

I don't remember "dissing ECCIE on TOS when ECCIE went down for a while", really. Feel free to summarize what my comments were. In fact I ask you to summarize my comments about Eccie on Indys right here in this thread so I know WTF you are talking about....

You and several other guys on this site can continue to BITCH, PISS, WHINE, and MOAN about the Indys review system. All of your BITCHING about Indys reviews has been going on for YEARS now. In fact it is one of the signature hallmarks of this site. Some people agree with you, others don't.....

I was a part of the Indys community for years and part of the ASPD community before that. I can think of about a half-dozen GREATER concerns involving Indys in the years I was a part of it. And guys here are BITCHING about Indys reviews? Much greater concerns with the hobby then and now....

I have not been a consistent Indys or Eccie player for years, but I have been active on SA since long before it started getting any press on Indys or Eccie. Most intel/analysis I have posted in the past few years has related to SA. SA changed the game in PGH. SA is going to continue to get press on this site and the new Indys if the new Indys actually has forums now.....

No, I don't understand all the Eccie guys BITCHING about the Indys review system. I can name several other greater concerns involving Indys that occurred within the last 10 years or so. ECCIE guys WHINING about Indys reviews? Some people agree with it, other people don't agree with it.....

Will Eccie draw more Indys players? Maybe, maybe not. Eccie has had the same dozen or so cast of characters for years. Hopefully more people from Indys make it over here. Get a little more variety here.....

And I hope two (2) sites remain in PGH. Not a good thing if one (1) site is the only game in town. That is what ASPD was in 2004. And because the Texas mods banned people and locked threads too quickly PGH people fled to Indys in 2005. Again, when one (1) site thinks it has a "monopoly" on intel exchange in a market like PGH then that is not good....

I’ve been on both sites as long as anyone. I wouldn’t call it “bitching” about Indy’s reviews. It was just stating fact. When I saw an honest, negative review on Indy’s I knew it would turn into a slugfest. It was good for laughs. As far as two sites in Pgh? There are two new local apps and ECCIE. Also SA, Eros, STG, Listcrawler etc to work with.

[berryberry]

Originally Posted by tolstoy

I don't remember "dissing ECCIE on TOS when ECCIE went down for a while", really. Feel free to summarize what my comments were. In fact I ask you to summarize my comments about Eccie on Indys right here in this thread so I know WTF you are talking about....

Well since old Indys is gone, no one can pull up those threads. So I don't have your comments (you really are not that memorable other than being the guy who repeats himself over and over writing 1000 words when 100 would do) but yea, you were dissing ECCIE when ECCIE went down.

As to the half a dozen times you mentioned Indys reviews, I guess you just can't handle the facts. That is what guys here deal with, facts - and commenting that Indy's reviews could not be relied on was a fact.

But again, since you admit you haven't been an Indys player for years, what the hell would you know

[tolstoy]

Originally Posted by bambino

I’ve been on both sites as long as anyone. I wouldn’t call it “bitching” about Indy’s reviews. It was just stating fact. When I saw an honest, negative review on Indy’s I knew it would turn into a slugfest. It was good for laughs. As far as two sites in Pgh? There are two new local apps and ECCIE. Also SA, Eros, STG, Listcrawler etc to work with.

I think the reviews on Indys were the same as the reviews on ASPD circa 2004. 9 out of 10 of them were positive reinforcement reviews of the "I had a great time! She is great!" variety. And 1 in 10 would become controversial and contentious in some way.....

Yes, providers could not respond to their own reviews on ASPD, and providers could respond to their own reviews on Indys. What do I think about that? Who.....CARES if Indys providers could respond to their own reviews. Many providers revealed/confirmed much about themselves by responding. Many providers I concluded "She handled that well. Seems like she has a good head on her shoulders." Other providers confirmed they were Not professional by the way they responded to negative reviews.....

Some providers understand and others do not understand that guys are interested in the "trends" in a providers press, not just one review. Within a few or a ten reviews of a new provider I knew if a provider was a Pro Ho or not. And reviews were Less Relevant than Guys Room intel and also guy-to-guy intel from hobbyists who like the same "type" of providers. Again, I think the reviews on Indys were basically the same as the reviews on ASPD circa 2004. And I did not CARE if Indys providers could respond to them. You know that created some entertaining reading.....

I was probably not as "diplomatic" with Berry Berry as Double Secret Sam I Am was, so I now apologize to Berry Berry and others who seem to have some "involved" perspective on the old Indys reviews. Nothing wrong with "over-analyzing" things, I do that myself often. I thought Berry Berry got a little personal with me here by vaguely referring to some comment I made about Eccie on Indys. I don't even know what that comment is, so I asked him to summarize it here. Any sort of comment about Eccie and it's blackout a couple months back applies to Indys too because they both went dark around the same time. I don't know what "dissing" of Eccie of mine Berry Berry referred to, and I overreacted. So I apologize to Berry Berry for that.....

THIS might happen: if the new Indys will really be a No Forums, Twitter type board then (very curiously) Eccie might be the new ASPD circa 2004. Plenty of PGH hobbyists, lots of PGH providers ads, new provider reviews seemingly every day. Lot's of "varied" content on ASPD circa 2004, much of it informative, much of it contentious. And then the Texas mods started locking threads too early and banning PGH hobbyists for specious reasons. So guys flocked to Indys starting in 2005.....

By the end of 2006 there were (yes) only a handful of Never-Indys guys on ASPD. After 2005 really the only active forum there was the DMZ and that was less than 10 politics junkies. Indys sapped all the energy and "personalities" out of the old ASPD, and QUICK.....

Will Eccie attract some Indys personalities? As our mod said very accurately in this thread: it's all about what vibe (my word) the regular, active members on Eccie (like you, me and Berry Berry for instance) create on Eccie. If it's just a bunch of guys complaining about Indys then people won't come over. (Or maybe they will come over to read that?) And, yes, I get your point that you and Berry Berry and others are not "bitching" about Indys reviews, just sharing your thoughts on them. So I apologize to Berry Berry for overreacting to his comment to me.....,

Eccie needs more veteran, experienced, humorous PGH hobby-people posting on it. For years it has been the same dozen or so guys and the same half-dozen or so providers posting, and often bickering with each other. Will Eccie attract Indys personalities? If Indys is really a No Forums board now then that might happen. Or it won't happen.....

[Double Secret Sam I Am]

FWIW right now Indys is nothing but ads and ISOs. I’m thinking ads will be there and guys room intel will be here. But who knows.

The way new Indys seems to work currently, you can post to “areas” or on your own “wall.” You designate that your posts are “public” “friends only” or only visible to yourself. I don’t understand the utility of posting for your own eyes only. You’re supposed to use hashtags to categorize your post, like #pittsbughads or #iso. Management keeps telling people not to post ads or ISO’s to areas but no one seems to do it “correctly” now. Everyone seems to posting ads and ISO’s to their respective areas with no discussion or intel being shared.

I posted three days ago asking if there will be a guy’s area or if I could restrict a post to just male members. As of yet no response.

[tolstoy]

Originally Posted by Double Secret Sam I Am

I agree with Tolstoy. The review section on Indys was what it was. You had to back channel and read the guys room to get the whole story but it was fairly easy to figure out which girls would meet your expectations on Indys.

The Pittsburgh hobby scene has certainly changed but I don’t think the quality of reviews on Indys has anything to do with it. Indys has certainly been in decline for at least five years but ECCIE wouldn’t seem to be the reason why. I have never noticed people “flocking” to ECCIE. There’s a core group of 10 or 15 people who have been posting here for about three or four years and that’s it. There’s nothing wrong with that but this site isn’t nearly as relevant to the hobby scene as Indys was from 2006 - 2011. There’s multiple reasons for the decline of Indys. I’d say the biggest reason would be the viability of SA. PI’s legal problems played a big role too. I’d say those two reasons were the biggest factors but there were many more.

Indys greatest feature was that it was a “one stop shop.“ In it’s day there were a ton of hot girls advertising there. The “vouch system“ allowed girls and guys to verify each other anonymously. The reviews and guys room Intel allowed it guys to get enough information to make intelligent choices about who to see.

My heyday in the hobby would’ve been 2008 through 2013 and I saw something like 120 escorts in that period of time. At one time or another I used Indys, Escorts.com, Eros, Date-check, and TER to screen or schedule my appointments. I’d say at least 80% was done on Indys. I don’t think there’s any site out there currently that could do what Indys used to do for the hobby in the Pittsburgh area.

In one of these threads, someone else pointed out that the usefulness of any website depends upon the people who use it. That applies to ECCIE and Indys alike. ECCIE doesn’t have as many members who post in Pittsburgh as Indys did in its heyday. There are very few ads posted here. There are very few girls who participate here at all. The guys who do post seem to be interested in girls that I would never be interested in seeing. So ECCIE appears to have a very limited usefulness to me. That doesn’t mean it isn’t useful for others. It just means that I don’t see much used to it. Everyone is different.

Right now, Indys is basically useless. ECCIE appears to be the only game in town. I probably will buy a premium membership here and I probably will read a lot more often than I have in the past which was once every three or four months . That said, I don’t really see ECCIE replacing Indys. Hell, Indys hasn’t been Indys for at least 3 years and I don’t see “Indys.ch” replacing Indys either. It’s a brave new hobby world that we will all have to adjust.

This is an unusually detailed and perceptive analysis of Indys and Eccie by a a veteran PGH hobbyist.....

On the SA point: no doubt many (many) experienced, veteran "personality" hobbyists flocked to SA several years ago, and they never indicated on Indys if they even see Indys providers anymore. Guys who used to see Indys providers, they had their ATF's and they saw new girls too, simply stopped posting about Indys providers. I don't know if that effected "business" on Indys because one of the hallmarks of Indys was that it was always attracting New Hobbyists. And many of them (legit or otherwise) complained about the "vouch" hoops to jump through. I don't have an "involved" perspective on the Indys vouch system like many Eccie guys do. Like Double Secret Sam I Am I think the Indys vouch system was pretty ideal actually. So in relation to SA many (many) "established" ASPD and old Indys hobbyists started hobbying there, and they stopped posting about Indys providers on Indys. That had an effect......

This is one way SA changed the scene: NEW girls debut on SA and not on Indys or Eccie. And that includes apparently ALL (or most of) the new Age 18-30 types in PGH. For years New Girls were debuting on Indys, with all the attendant smooth-career-transitioning and also controversy and drama. Many new Indys providers would get 10 or so reviews and then disappear from the board. Why? Because they established a "market demand" to get all regular clients and then not have to advertise. They went UTR and dealt with all regular clients Because....They.....Could. Other new girls BURNED OUT in some weird, urban-hobby-drama stories. Other providers became "established" on Indys and then became regular board personalities, or just often advertising providers who never posted. It seems the last several years of Indys was the same "established" providers. Most of them had good reps for "professionalism" and easy to book. And on SA you have Hot Flakes and Pro Ho's. So there was more "consistency" on Indys, and whether or not public reviews and Guys Room press interested you in seeing Indys providers.....

That is how SA changed the PGH hobby scene. Scores of New Providers debut there and not on Indys or Eccie. And there are Clueless Newbies and Pro Ho's on SA. And there is no public review system and no Guys Room on SA so guys have to fly-by-the-seat-of-their-pants there......

Why did Indys change to a new Twitter-like, apparently No Forums board? The new owners and admins would have to confirm. I'm thinking it probably had to do with 1.) FOSTA and 2.) the Cleveland bust. The Cleveland bust itself eliminated PGH and OH GTG's at least for a while. That had an effect. With the new "friends only" format on the new Indys does that really ABSOLVE the new Indys of any FOSTA law breaking? I guess lawyers would have to answer that. Did not the old ASPD and the old Indys think "Hey- it's just a social media site. We ain't breaking the law here...."? I don't know if the new Indys site is any more "legal" than the old one. Lawyers would have to weigh-in on that one.....

I hope two (2) hobby-boards remain in PGH. Just in case many of the more "contentious" personalities Get Banned from either board then they can go on to the other board. "Keep each other in check" is the name of the game with hobby-boards. Don't let one or the other have a "monopoly" on hobby-intel. And hopefully the mods on both sites don't end up like the ASPD Texas mods circa 2004, locking threads pre-maturely and banning PGH hobby people for specious reasons.....